Running PowerBuilder 7.x app under Windows ME

Anybody know what the official status is with PowerBuilder 7.0.x projects
running under Windows Me???

The IS department here just updated some of our users machines to Window Me,
and I can't find anything about Sybase's official position for running a
PowerBuilder application on a Windows Me machine.

TIA for any information on this.

Jeff Gibson
Intercept Solutions
Nashville, TN


0
Jeff
4/5/2002 7:35:04 PM
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AFAIK This is not a supported platform.
According to the Installation Guide, NT 4 or higher or Win 95 or Win98 are
the required platforms. If you have a problem specific to WinME, you will
not get an engineering fix.



"Jeff Gibson" <jgibson@interceptsolutions.com> wrote in message
news:f3u7soN3BHA.206@forums.sybase.com...
> Anybody know what the official status is with PowerBuilder 7.0.x projects
> running under Windows Me???
>
> The IS department here just updated some of our users machines to Window
Me,
> and I can't find anything about Sybase's official position for running a
> PowerBuilder application on a Windows Me machine.
>
> TIA for any information on this.
>
> Jeff Gibson
> Intercept Solutions
> Nashville, TN
>
>


0
Chris
4/5/2002 8:04:24 PM
It's not a supported platform, meaning that Sybase will not try to fix
something that breaks on ME but works on 98, NT, or 2K.

Jeff Gibson wrote in message ...
>Anybody know what the official status is with PowerBuilder 7.0.x projects
>running under Windows Me???
>
>The IS department here just updated some of our users machines to Window
Me,
>and I can't find anything about Sybase's official position for running a
>PowerBuilder application on a Windows Me machine.
>
>TIA for any information on this.
>
>Jeff Gibson
>Intercept Solutions
>Nashville, TN
>
>


0
Jerry
4/5/2002 8:08:40 PM
Windows ME is the buggiest version of Windows ever released.  Most IS
departments I'm aware of immediately change the OS of any machine that comes
in with ME to NT, 2000 or even back to 98SE.

-EGM


Chris Keating <nospam_keating@iAnywhere.com> wrote in message
news:lIzlz4N3BHA.186@forums.sybase.com...
> AFAIK This is not a supported platform.
> According to the Installation Guide, NT 4 or higher or Win 95 or Win98 are
> the required platforms. If you have a problem specific to WinME, you will
> not get an engineering fix.
>
>
>
> "Jeff Gibson" <jgibson@interceptsolutions.com> wrote in message
> news:f3u7soN3BHA.206@forums.sybase.com...
> > Anybody know what the official status is with PowerBuilder 7.0.x
projects
> > running under Windows Me???
> >
> > The IS department here just updated some of our users machines to Window
> Me,
> > and I can't find anything about Sybase's official position for running a
> > PowerBuilder application on a Windows Me machine.
> >
> > TIA for any information on this.
> >
> > Jeff Gibson
> > Intercept Solutions
> > Nashville, TN
> >
> >
>
>


0
Edward
4/5/2002 8:20:18 PM
"Edward Muesch" <emuesch@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:MCt1oDO3BHA.133@forums.sybase.com...
> Windows ME is the buggiest version of Windows ever released.  Most IS
> departments I'm aware of immediately change the OS of any machine that
comes
> in with ME to NT, 2000 or even back to 98SE.

Edward,

What kind of problems are you seeing with Windows Me?  Everything we've
tested shows that Me is more stable the Windows 98SE.

TIA for the info.

Jeff Gibson
Intercept Solutions
Nashville, TN

> -EGM
>
>
> Chris Keating <nospam_keating@iAnywhere.com> wrote in message
> news:lIzlz4N3BHA.186@forums.sybase.com...
> > AFAIK This is not a supported platform.
> > According to the Installation Guide, NT 4 or higher or Win 95 or Win98
are
> > the required platforms. If you have a problem specific to WinME, you
will
> > not get an engineering fix.
> >
> >
> >
> > "Jeff Gibson" <jgibson@interceptsolutions.com> wrote in message
> > news:f3u7soN3BHA.206@forums.sybase.com...
> > > Anybody know what the official status is with PowerBuilder 7.0.x
> projects
> > > running under Windows Me???
> > >
> > > The IS department here just updated some of our users machines to
Window
> > Me,
> > > and I can't find anything about Sybase's official position for running
a
> > > PowerBuilder application on a Windows Me machine.
> > >
> > > TIA for any information on this.
> > >
> > > Jeff Gibson
> > > Intercept Solutions
> > > Nashville, TN



0
Jeff
4/6/2002 6:49:03 AM
I haven't used it myself but two people I know of personally who both bought
machines with it pre-installed both complained about constant lock-ups.  My
fianc�'s company fired their IT contractor when he brought in machines with
ME and they had some severe problems running a couple of legacy apps and
with network printing.  That's not to say everybody would have the same
problems but just about every time I hear the OS mentioned in a conversation
there is usually somebody with a negative story.

-EGM

Jeff Gibson <jgibson@interceptsolutions.com> wrote in message
news:LX3aphT3BHA.133@forums.sybase.com...
> "Edward Muesch" <emuesch@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:MCt1oDO3BHA.133@forums.sybase.com...
> > Windows ME is the buggiest version of Windows ever released.  Most IS
> > departments I'm aware of immediately change the OS of any machine that
> comes
> > in with ME to NT, 2000 or even back to 98SE.
>
> Edward,
>
> What kind of problems are you seeing with Windows Me?  Everything we've
> tested shows that Me is more stable the Windows 98SE.
>
> TIA for the info.
>
> Jeff Gibson
> Intercept Solutions
> Nashville, TN
>
> > -EGM
> >
> >
> > Chris Keating <nospam_keating@iAnywhere.com> wrote in message
> > news:lIzlz4N3BHA.186@forums.sybase.com...
> > > AFAIK This is not a supported platform.
> > > According to the Installation Guide, NT 4 or higher or Win 95 or Win98
> are
> > > the required platforms. If you have a problem specific to WinME, you
> will
> > > not get an engineering fix.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > "Jeff Gibson" <jgibson@interceptsolutions.com> wrote in message
> > > news:f3u7soN3BHA.206@forums.sybase.com...
> > > > Anybody know what the official status is with PowerBuilder 7.0.x
> > projects
> > > > running under Windows Me???
> > > >
> > > > The IS department here just updated some of our users machines to
> Window
> > > Me,
> > > > and I can't find anything about Sybase's official position for
running
> a
> > > > PowerBuilder application on a Windows Me machine.
> > > >
> > > > TIA for any information on this.
> > > >
> > > > Jeff Gibson
> > > > Intercept Solutions
> > > > Nashville, TN
>
>
>


0
Edward
4/6/2002 11:08:24 AM
I am very surprised to hear that an IS department for a company would even
consider WindowsME.  I thought that it was created as a personal PC product
and that any serious business would avoid it like the plague.  Lots of
products aimed at businesses are only supported up to Win98SE and thereafter
on NT/2000 (none of the software products that we use for software
development are supported on ME) - evidence of the expectation that
WindowsME was never seriously considered for businesses, just as part of
cheap PC packages for home users.

I also agree with Edward - all the anecdotal evidence that I have heard
points to ME being a mess, with "constant lock-ups" being a regular
complaint.  My personal experience (I have ME at home) is only of occasional
lockups, but I've never had one at work (under NT4 and now 2000).

Jeff, I would suggest a re-think by your IS guys!  (Sorry)

--
Andrew Linn
Software Engineering Consultant
Daniel Systems Australia

"Edward Muesch" <emuesch@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:8Yt4FzV3BHA.298@forums.sybase.com...
> I haven't used it myself but two people I know of personally who both
bought
> machines with it pre-installed both complained about constant lock-ups.
My
> fianc�'s company fired their IT contractor when he brought in machines
with
> ME and they had some severe problems running a couple of legacy apps and
> with network printing.  That's not to say everybody would have the same
> problems but just about every time I hear the OS mentioned in a
conversation
> there is usually somebody with a negative story.
>
> -EGM
>
> Jeff Gibson <jgibson@interceptsolutions.com> wrote in message
> news:LX3aphT3BHA.133@forums.sybase.com...
> > "Edward Muesch" <emuesch@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> > news:MCt1oDO3BHA.133@forums.sybase.com...
> > > Windows ME is the buggiest version of Windows ever released.  Most IS
> > > departments I'm aware of immediately change the OS of any machine that
> > comes
> > > in with ME to NT, 2000 or even back to 98SE.
> >
> > Edward,
> >
> > What kind of problems are you seeing with Windows Me?  Everything we've
> > tested shows that Me is more stable the Windows 98SE.
> >
> > TIA for the info.
> >
> > Jeff Gibson
> > Intercept Solutions
> > Nashville, TN
> >
> > > -EGM
> > >
> > >
> > > Chris Keating <nospam_keating@iAnywhere.com> wrote in message
> > > news:lIzlz4N3BHA.186@forums.sybase.com...
> > > > AFAIK This is not a supported platform.
> > > > According to the Installation Guide, NT 4 or higher or Win 95 or
Win98
> > are
> > > > the required platforms. If you have a problem specific to WinME, you
> > will
> > > > not get an engineering fix.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > "Jeff Gibson" <jgibson@interceptsolutions.com> wrote in message
> > > > news:f3u7soN3BHA.206@forums.sybase.com...
> > > > > Anybody know what the official status is with PowerBuilder 7.0.x
> > > projects
> > > > > running under Windows Me???
> > > > >
> > > > > The IS department here just updated some of our users machines to
> > Window
> > > > Me,
> > > > > and I can't find anything about Sybase's official position for
> running
> > a
> > > > > PowerBuilder application on a Windows Me machine.
> > > > >
> > > > > TIA for any information on this.
> > > > >
> > > > > Jeff Gibson
> > > > > Intercept Solutions
> > > > > Nashville, TN
> >
> >
> >
>
>


0
Andrew
4/8/2002 1:14:50 AM
"Andrew Linn" <NO.SPAM.oscar@dsa.com.au> wrote in message
news:EIZZRyp3BHA.133@forums.sybase.com...

Andrew,

Here is what we have to deal with...

We sell commercial software to a large market that ranges from Mom and Pop
shops running 2 computers running peer to peer file sharing, to larger
organizations running up to 50 or 100 computers on a network.

These smaller shops go down to the local Best Buy, purchase a couple
computers, some networks cards and a hub, and wala, they have their network.

Most of these smaller shops are now running Windows ME.  The only reason
"Some" of them have gone to 2000, is not because they know it is a better
OS.  It's because they really thought that 2000 was the upgrade to 98.

I agree with you that NT/2000/XP are better OS's.  The problem is that we
don't control what people buy for their machines.  What we want is the
option to deploy to these machines with no problem.  Microsoft only lets you
develop .net products on NT/2000/XP, but supports the deployment to 98 and
ME.  I'm sure that Boland does the same since 95 has been dropped by
Microsoft as a supported OS.

> I am very surprised to hear that an IS department for a company would even
> consider WindowsME.

The problem here is that our client that is developing this software is
currently running some older 16-bit software that only runs correctly on 95,
98 or ME.  It won't run on NT or higher correctly.  Once this other software
is done, we will be able to move the machines up to 2000 or XP, but not
until then.

> I thought that it was created as a personal PC product
> and that any serious business would avoid it like the plague.

For large companies yes, not for some small businesses though.

> Lots of products aimed at businesses are only supported up to Win98SE
> and thereafter on NT/2000 (none of the software products that we use for
> software development are supported on ME) - evidence of the expectation
that
> WindowsME was never seriously considered for businesses, just as part of
> cheap PC packages for home users.

What software are you trying to run?  We have been able to install a full
slew of products on the Windows ME machines we have here, and they are
running just fine.

> I also agree with Edward - all the anecdotal evidence that I have heard
> points to ME being a mess, with "constant lock-ups" being a regular
> complaint.  My personal experience (I have ME at home) is only of
occasional
> lockups, but I've never had one at work (under NT4 and now 2000).

The key issue here is where did Microsoft market the OS.  I agree with you
that Me was marketed towards the home market, but it's built on the same
code base as the 9x OS platform.  You can do everything you do in 98 and
then some in ME.  And 98 was marketed towards to the business community when
it came out.

> Jeff, I would suggest a re-think by your IS guys!  (Sorry)

Like I said, out of our control.

I will repeat again though, we are not seeing these Horrible Me issues you
and Edward were discussing.  Everything is quite stable and runs just fine
against our NT and 2000 servers.  The Office 2002 suite runs on these
machines with no issues, along with some additional software to handle
Accounting and Project Management.

Thanks for the response.

My impression from what I am seeing so far is that our application we are
developing is running just fine under Windows Me.  We will just need to be
able to reproduce any issues we have under Windows Me under Windows 98 as
well if we need a bug fixed from Sybase.

Jeff Gibson
Intercept Solutions
Nashville, TN

> --
> Andrew Linn
> Software Engineering Consultant
> Daniel Systems Australia


0
Jeff
4/8/2002 5:41:06 PM
Jeff.

Thanks for your measured response.

I have to admit that I assumed that you were talking about your shop (ie
your IDE and other development environment applications), not your clients.
I understand the difficulties at the smaller end of town.  I did not know
what complications/limitations there are for PB applications deployed to
ME - which I realise now was the thrust of your question.  My quick look has
found the info at the bottom of this post:

I understand that legacy applications are always around for a period that
doesn't match Microsoft's "upgrade" pressure.  But I took it that the IS
department had just bought ME PCs for you to develop on - something that I
would be rethinking - since no Sybase products are supported under ME.  If
you are deploying to ME though, you will probably need access to ME PCs for
functional and deployment testing so having them is not a drama.

When I said that our applications were not supported under ME, I wasn't
meaning that they don't run under ME (and probably, as you say, with few
problems).  The issue is, like with Sybase and PowerBuilder, that they are
not supported under ME so, again as you say, problems would have to be
reproduced under a supported platform before you got any help from the
application supplier.  Something that I think businesses should invest to
avoid!

Quoting Chris Keating when asked a similar question

> Development and deployment requirements are similar. If
> you cannot develop on the platform, you cannot deploy on the platfrom
(from
> a supportability perspective). You may be able to get a PB8 application
> running on Win95 but if a problem occurs only in Win95, it won't be fixed.

> Support is limited to supported and GA releases of the OS at the time that
> the major release is shipped. New OS support will be added either in a MR
or
> the next major release subject to the changes in the OS.

> As a result, Win95 or WinXP are not supported as WIn95 was not supported
and
> WinXP was not GA when PB8 shipped.

And quoting Roy Kiesler:

> Windows ME will not be supported at this time.

which is the only forward-looking statement about PB and ME that I can
find - anywhere!  Whether "at this time" indicates any likelihood of support
for ME in the future - I don't know.

Looking around, most problems found running PB under ME seem to be resolved
just like on any other platform, ie ME is not the issue.  But you will hear
the "it isn't supported" comment a lot if you develop under ME.

So, in the end, I agree with Chris' original response to your question.
Beyond that, it is all in your hands (well, your client's hands).

Good luck

Cheers

--
Andrew Linn
Software Engineering Consultant
Daniel Systems Australia


0
Andrew
4/9/2002 3:27:15 AM
Reply:

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