One More PB 10 Wish List for Client/Server applications

Purpose: Continue to enhance PB and keep it the very best tool to build
client-server applications. My purpose is not to hinder other extensions,
but to continue to keep the customer base that has been loyal to PB through
many versions.

1.    A Rich Text Control that supports new versions of RTF and Word RTF
2.    Better control on DW group headers (allow not to be repeated on each
page option)
3.    Fix WingDing font problem (since 9 beta 4)
4.    Include (or header files) for global variables, global constants, and
global external functions (conditional compiles #if var = 1 and #ifdef var )
5.    An IDE that does not GPF, ( if a GPF happens save enough information
so that it can be reported. other than just another crash that can not be
reproduced at will)
6.    Publish weekly EBF builds (disclaimers OK, but fixes should be
available quickly)
7.    Support runtime on Linux, FreeBSD, Sun, and Mac clients (Linux and Mac
as most important)
8.    Allow direct calls to .Net framework as if they were native PB
functions (on windows only)
9.    Remove *= and =* where clause join syntax, always generate ANSI Join
syntax
10.  Allow #pragma clauses to prevent syntax checking on selective SQL
statements. (example: when using a SQL Server temp file that does not yet
exist)


0
Tyler
10/27/2003 12:36:45 AM
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Point 9 would be difficult to do given that ANSI and TSQL (*= and =*) may
not yield equivalent results and applications that rely on the TSQL
behaviour could break as a result. Sybase ASE and MS SQL Server both are
encouraging customers to move to ANSI outer join syntax. ASA never
recommended TSQL outer joins syntax but supported it for compatiblity with
ASE.

-- 

Chris Keating
Sybase Adaptive Server Anywhere Professional Version 8

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and try out the market-leading database for mobile, embedded and small to
medium sized business environments for free!

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"Tyler Cruse" <tcruse@trlx.com> wrote in message
news:3f9c77b8$1@forums-2-dub...
> Purpose: Continue to enhance PB and keep it the very best tool to build
> client-server applications. My purpose is not to hinder other extensions,
> but to continue to keep the customer base that has been loyal to PB
through
> many versions.
>
> 1.    A Rich Text Control that supports new versions of RTF and Word RTF
> 2.    Better control on DW group headers (allow not to be repeated on each
> page option)
> 3.    Fix WingDing font problem (since 9 beta 4)
> 4.    Include (or header files) for global variables, global constants,
and
> global external functions (conditional compiles #if var = 1 and #ifdef
var )
> 5.    An IDE that does not GPF, ( if a GPF happens save enough information
> so that it can be reported. other than just another crash that can not be
> reproduced at will)
> 6.    Publish weekly EBF builds (disclaimers OK, but fixes should be
> available quickly)
> 7.    Support runtime on Linux, FreeBSD, Sun, and Mac clients (Linux and
Mac
> as most important)
> 8.    Allow direct calls to .Net framework as if they were native PB
> functions (on windows only)
> 9.    Remove *= and =* where clause join syntax, always generate ANSI Join
> syntax
> 10.  Allow #pragma clauses to prevent syntax checking on selective SQL
> statements. (example: when using a SQL Server temp file that does not yet
> exist)
>
>


0
Chris
10/27/2003 2:46:53 AM
Aslam-o-Aleikum

Firs of all I would like to mension that I am novice to
NewsGroups so please accept my applogies if my response is
not according to  your intensions.

I wish a way of formatting column borders in datawindow as
one can format a Cell in Excel. i.e, Left, Right, Over, or
Under Line with option to change the Color & Style of border
lines. I think this will help in creating great looking
Cross Tabs and SaveAs HTML! should also work fine.
0
Abdul
10/27/2003 11:48:57 AM
"Tyler Cruse" <tcruse@trlx.com> wrote in message
news:3f9c77b8$1@forums-2-dub...
<snip/>
> 3.    Fix WingDing font problem (since 9 beta 4)
Did you report this as a bug? What's the CR?

> 4.    Include (or header files) for global variables, global constants,
and
> global external functions (conditional compiles #if var = 1 and #ifdef
var )

A nice-to-have, but IMHO, will have little impact on the product's future.

> 5.    An IDE that does not GPF, ( if a GPF happens save enough information
> so that it can be reported. other than just another crash that can not be
> reproduced at will)

There's no such thing. That said, you can geta Crash Handler tool from
support that will save additional information to help diagnose those
unreproduceable crashes (no guarantees)

> 6.    Publish weekly EBF builds (disclaimers OK, but fixes should be
> available quickly)

There is already work done in this direction, however, this has little to do
with PB 10 features...

> 7.    Support runtime on Linux, FreeBSD, Sun, and Mac clients (Linux and
Mac
> as most important)

One at a time...

> 8.    Allow direct calls to .Net framework as if they were native PB
> functions (on windows only)

Slated for PB 11

> 10.  Allow #pragma clauses to prevent syntax checking on selective SQL
> statements. (example: when using a SQL Server temp file that does not yet
> exist)

Now that would be cool!

-- 
<hopethishelps/>
Roy Kiesler [TeamSybase]
SDN CodeXchange -- http://codexchange.sybase.com


0
Roy
10/27/2003 12:40:48 PM
Somme comments below...

On 26 Oct 2003 17:36:45 -0700, "Tyler Cruse" <tcruse@trlx.com> wrote:

>Purpose: Continue to enhance PB and keep it the very best tool to build
>client-server applications. My purpose is not to hinder other extensions,
>but to continue to keep the customer base that has been loyal to PB through
>many versions.
>
>1.    A Rich Text Control that supports new versions of RTF and Word RTF
There are some rumblings about this, but I do not know where this
stands.  This was a particularly common comment at the "Ask the
Experts" session at TechWave as well, so I know the message has been
received.

>2.    Better control on DW group headers (allow not to be repeated on each
>page option)
Submitting an enhancement for this one is the best advice I can give.
Some will want it one way, some another, so we'll need to make this
customizable.

>3.    Fix WingDing font problem (since 9 beta 4)
The next build should have this fix, by the way, Tyler -- I suspect in
a week or two.  I will contact you via the open support case you have
filed.

>4.    Include (or header files) for global variables, global constants, and
>global external functions (conditional compiles #if var = 1 and #ifdef var )
Let me pass this on to the compiler people, since with many of the
language additions planned, this could fit in as well.

>5.    An IDE that does not GPF, ( if a GPF happens save enough information
>so that it can be reported. other than just another crash that can not be
>reproduced at will)
is that one before or after 'world peace'?  Not to make light, but
that's a tough one to deliver on.  I think everyone had seen
improvement in the last few releases and there were some significant
crash issues reported on these newsgroups in just the past few months
that have recent fixes (e.g., the tooltips crash in the debugger, the
handle leak with customized painter layouts).  

There are a lot of different ways developers use PB and it's an
np-complete problem to test them all, so the more issues that get
opened by customers, the more likely we will be able to squash the
bugs.  There is a 'crash handler' version of the PB executable as well
that Technical Support can provide for open cases which can help to
locate where crashes occur.  It's not a panacea, but does provide just
about as much information as possible when a crash occurs.  In
practice, the biggest issue with using that output is that when the
GPF occurs is not always when the real problem/bug occurred.

>6.    Publish weekly EBF builds (disclaimers OK, but fixes should be
>available quickly)
These are available to ANYONE, but we encourage customers to pursue
these via support so they are aware of limitations, remaining issues,
etc.  The problem with disclaimers is that people don't read them or
think that they apply to the other guy.  

All that said, I believe we are heading towards making those more
public than they are now.  In return though, Sybase will suffer a bit
for 'quality' related issues even though the disclaimers indicate
these are EBF builds that have not been through the entire QA process.

>7.    Support runtime on Linux, FreeBSD, Sun, and Mac clients (Linux and Mac
>as most important)
You mean the GUI parts too not just the EAServer PBVM?  We had Unix
and Mac, you'll remember, and the demand was not high then.  This was
in the PB5 and 6 era when PowerBuilder was still in the height of it's
popularity.  Given the declined usage (for whatever reasons) in the
Windows market, it's prettly unlikely to see this type of investment
in the future unless things turn around substantially.  There are
increased talks about a Linux PBVM for EAServer however.

>8.    Allow direct calls to .Net framework as if they were native PB
>functions (on windows only)
Via COM is not enough?  PB is moving to include a pure .NET option,
but in the meantime I was under the impression that the COM interop
layer should be sufficient.  If there's particular issues in that
regard that we could address sooner rather than later, please open a
support case.

>9.    Remove *= and =* where clause join syntax, always generate ANSI Join
>syntax
That's a configurable DBParm option isn't it?  If so, I don't see that
going away.  The default you want might not be what PB sees as the
default, but we still have people using database software that's 5+
years old, so we have to maintain the various compatibility levels.

>10.  Allow #pragma clauses to prevent syntax checking on selective SQL
>statements. (example: when using a SQL Server temp file that does not yet
>exist)
I'd group this with #4.
>
>

Jim O'Neil
Principal Technical Support Engineer
Sybase, Inc.
Concord, MA
0
joneil
10/27/2003 1:04:12 PM
You would be better asking this question first as a separate thread (i.e.,
new post) and to an group that most closely matches your question such as
the datawindow group sybase.public.powerbuilder.datawindow.

/ck

<Abdul Sattar> wrote in message news:3f9d1439.4e92.846930886@sybase.com...
> Aslam-o-Aleikum
>
> Firs of all I would like to mension that I am novice to
> NewsGroups so please accept my applogies if my response is
> not according to  your intensions.
>
> I wish a way of formatting column borders in datawindow as
> one can format a Cell in Excel. i.e, Left, Right, Over, or
> Under Line with option to change the Color & Style of border
> lines. I think this will help in creating great looking
> Cross Tabs and SaveAs HTML! should also work fine.


0
Chris
10/27/2003 1:30:59 PM
Other than being unclear on what "over and under line" means, most of
what you asked for is possible now, either in the painter or with the
Modify() command at run time. SaveAs (HTML!) isn't meant to save the
presentation layer though, if that's what you mean by "work fine".
However, you *can* save the presentation layer in HTML (with a few
restrictions):
http://www.techno-kitten.com/PFC_Notes/Datawindow_HTML_Save/datawindow_html_save.html.

Good luck,

Terry [TeamSybase] and Sequel the techno-kitten

On 27 Oct 2003 04:48:57 -0700, Abdul Sattar wrote:

>Aslam-o-Aleikum
>
>Firs of all I would like to mension that I am novice to
>NewsGroups so please accept my applogies if my response is
>not according to  your intensions.
>
>I wish a way of formatting column borders in datawindow as
>one can format a Cell in Excel. i.e, Left, Right, Over, or
>Under Line with option to change the Color & Style of border
>lines. I think this will help in creating great looking
>Cross Tabs and SaveAs HTML! should also work fine.


Sequel's Sandbox: http://www.techno-kitten.com
Home of PBL Peeper, a free PowerBuilder Developer's Toolkit. 
Version 2.2.06 now available at the Sandbox
See the PB Troubleshooting Guide at the Sandbox
^ ^
o o
=*=
0
Terry
10/27/2003 2:00:22 PM
"> >3.    Fix WingDing font problem (since 9 beta 4)
> The next build should have this fix, by the way, Tyler -- I suspect in
> a week or two.  I will contact you via the open support case you have
> filed.
Thanks for the feed back, I suspected that it would get fixed in due time.

> >5.    An IDE that does not GPF, ( if a GPF happens save enough
information
> >so that it can be reported. other than just another crash that can not be
> >reproduced at will)
> is that one before or after 'world peace'?  Not to make light, but
> that's a tough one to deliver on.  I think everyone had seen
> improvement in the last few releases and there were some significant
> crash issues reported on these newsgroups in just the past few months
> that have recent fixes (e.g., the tooltips crash in the debugger, the
> handle leak with customized painter layouts).
>
> There are a lot of different ways developers use PB and it's an
> np-complete problem to test them all, so the more issues that get
> opened by customers, the more likely we will be able to squash the
> bugs.  There is a 'crash handler' version of the PB executable as well
> that Technical Support can provide for open cases which can help to
> locate where crashes occur.  It's not a panacea, but does provide just
> about as much information as possible when a crash occurs.  In
> practice, the biggest issue with using that output is that when the
> GPF occurs is not always when the real problem/bug occurred.

Yes, I agree that 100% is probably impossible. However, this is an area that
still needs
improvement.   Build 7011 still has issues on saving scripts and searching
from time to time.  Never
have I been able to "reproduce", only after some use (usually over an hour)
the application will crash on something simple like adding a comment and
saving a script.  I would hope that this quality issue would continue to be
kept on the forefront.  The crashes have improved, but still happen too
often for many.
My opinion is that PB will never be the most popular or cheapest tool for
writing programs, so the other option is to be a high end tool that has high
performance.

> >6.    Publish weekly EBF builds (disclaimers OK, but fixes should be
> >available quickly)
> These are available to ANYONE, but we encourage customers to pursue
> these via support so they are aware of limitations, remaining issues,
> etc.  The problem with disclaimers is that people don't read them or
> think that they apply to the other guy.
>
> All that said, I believe we are heading towards making those more
> public than they are now.  In return though, Sybase will suffer a bit
> for 'quality' related issues even though the disclaimers indicate
> these are EBF builds that have not been through the entire QA process.

I can see the point of people that want one "service pack" level releases,
however,  the quality of the service pack level releases depends on the
quality of the individual fixes along the way.  So, the more people that use
the EBF level releases and report issues back the more likely that problems
will be resolved between "service pack" level releases.

> >7.    Support runtime on Linux, FreeBSD, Sun, and Mac clients (Linux and
Mac
> >as most important)
> You mean the GUI parts too not just the EAServer PBVM?  We had Unix
> and Mac, you'll remember, and the demand was not high then.  This was
> in the PB5 and 6 era when PowerBuilder was still in the height of it's
> popularity.  Given the declined usage (for whatever reasons) in the
> Windows market, it's prettly unlikely to see this type of investment
> in the future unless things turn around substantially.  There are
> increased talks about a Linux PBVM for EAServer however.

Again, Sybase should have a reasonable ROI on every project.  Today, Windows
is the business market place.  This, like all things in computing will
follow a cycle.  There will be some OS that will replace Windows, now today
that looks like Linux has best chance.  Time and the market place will tell.
Thinking back when IBM was the only game in town and SAA was going to be the
"framework" that made everything work together.  Just about the time that
"Windows NT" started taking on the world.

In our case, if PB supported Linux Runtime (not EAServer) it would reduce
the cost of computing for our customers by about 50%.  The current crop of
desk top tools for Linux are good enough, driver support for
scanners/printers/medical equipment is as good as for Windows.  PB is the
only missing link keeping our customers from dumping Windows.  (Note: MS
SQLServer would probably continue to the database server of choice, MySQL is
not quite in the same level of performance/support)

> >9.    Remove *= and =* where clause join syntax, always generate ANSI
Join
> >syntax
> That's a configurable DBParm option isn't it?  If so, I don't see that
> going away.  The default you want might not be what PB sees as the
> default, but we still have people using database software that's 5+
> years old, so we have to maintain the various compatibility levels.
Yes, I agree that you can configure "join type" in DBParm.  However, I still
think that based on posting on this news group, there are still way too many
problems caused by this syntax.



0
Tyler
10/27/2003 2:28:50 PM
Tyler Cruse wrote:
> 8.    Allow direct calls to .Net framework as if they were native PB
> functions (on windows only)

  I suspect that this is more of an issue with .net than with PB. AFAIK,
MS's solution is to go through COM. Delphi for .net is supposed to be able
to produce .net assemblies that can be called directly by unmanaged code,
but I think that it's the only tool that can do that.

--
Mike Swaim swaim@hal-pc.org at home
mpswaim@mdanderson.org or mswaim@odin.mdacc.tmc.edu at work
Disclaimer: Yeah, like I speak for MD Anderson.
Quote: "Boingie"^4 Y,W & D


0
Mike
11/6/2003 8:23:04 PM
Reply:

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