Odd Header

Why, when I examine e-mail headers with CTRL-U is the first header
"From" (as distinct from the "From:" header further down) and the date?
Sam Spade says it doesn't recognise the header - which seems reasonable
to me!

Regards,

Bob

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Bob
1/11/2006 3:51:57 PM
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On 1/11/2006 7:51 AM On a whim, Bob Henson pounded out on the keyboard

> Why, when I examine e-mail headers with CTRL-U is the first header
> "From" (as distinct from the "From:" header further down) and the date?
> Sam Spade says it doesn't recognise the header - which seems reasonable
> to me!
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Bob
> 

Hi Bob,

Can you clarify a bit? This is what I see in your header (1st 4 lines):
Path: 
local01.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.mozilla.org!news.mozilla.org.POSTED!not-for-mail
NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 11 Jan 2006 09:51:55 -0600
Date: Wed, 11 Jan 2006 15:51:57 +0000
From: Bob Henson <news@galenx.org.uk>

No other From is listed.
-- 
Terry

***Reply Note***
Anti-spam measures are included in my email address.
Delete NOSPAM from the email address after clicking Reply.
0
Terry
1/11/2006 7:31:44 PM
Terry wrote

>> Why, when I examine e-mail headers with CTRL-U is the first header
>> "From" (as distinct from the "From:" header further down) and the date?
>> Sam Spade says it doesn't recognise the header - which seems reasonable
>> to me!

> Can you clarify a bit? This is what I see in your header (1st 4 lines):
> Path: local01.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.mozilla.org!news.mozilla.org.POSTED!not-for-mail

> No other From is listed.

It only applies to e-mail, not news. Here's the first bit of one from
Microsoft this morning.

Quote on ......

From - Wed Jan 11 02:08:21 2006
X-Account-Key: account2
X-UIDL: 47bef90f3b433d04ff22b64da10e7b0e
X-Mozilla-Status: 0001
X-Mozilla-Status2: 00000000
Envelope-to: bob.henson@galenx.org.uk
Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1])
	by mx13.global.net.uk with smtp (Exim 4.42)
	id 1EwVLz-00032T-9c
	for bob.henson@galenx.org.uk; Wed, 11 Jan 2006 02:04:47 +0000
Received: from delivery2.pens.microsoft.com ([207.46.248.41])
	by mx13.global.net.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.42)
	id 1EwVLy-00031k-Je
	for bob.henson@galenx.org.uk; Wed, 11 Jan 2006 02:04:47 +0000
Received: from TK2MSFTDDSQ07 ([10.40.5.15]) by delivery2.pens.microsoft.com
with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.211);
	 Tue, 10 Jan 2006 18:04:45 -0800
Thread-Topic: Microsoft Security Newsletter: Outfitting a new computer for
the Internet
thread-index: AcYWU2SXVUxyd1zNS0Gpy7ey5GaJ+A==
Reply-To: "Microsoft"
<10_27610_FqgV0Fi6zp+96VAQEVtVNA@newsletters.microsoft.com>
From: "Microsoft" <10_27610_FqgV0Fi6zp+96VAQEVtVNA@newsletters.microsoft.com>

Quote off...............

The last line is the correct From: line - so what gives with line 1? Every
E-mail I get is the same, so I wondered if it was just me. It isn't new to v
1.5, it's been the same for ages.

Regards,

Bob


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0
Bob
1/11/2006 7:51:00 PM
On 1/11/2006 11:51 AM Bob Henson scribbled:

> Terry wrote
> 
> 
>>>Why, when I examine e-mail headers with CTRL-U is the first header
>>>"From" (as distinct from the "From:" header further down) and the date?
>>>Sam Spade says it doesn't recognise the header - which seems reasonable
>>>to me!
> 
> 
>>Can you clarify a bit? This is what I see in your header (1st 4 lines):
>>Path: local01.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.mozilla.org!news.mozilla.org.POSTED!not-for-mail
> 
> 
>>No other From is listed.
> 
> 
> It only applies to e-mail, not news. Here's the first bit of one from
> Microsoft this morning.
> 
> Quote on ......
> 
> From - Wed Jan 11 02:08:21 2006
> X-Account-Key: account2
> X-UIDL: 47bef90f3b433d04ff22b64da10e7b0e
> X-Mozilla-Status: 0001
> X-Mozilla-Status2: 00000000
> Envelope-to: bob.henson@galenx.org.uk
> Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1])
> 	by mx13.global.net.uk with smtp (Exim 4.42)
> 	id 1EwVLz-00032T-9c
> 	for bob.henson@galenx.org.uk; Wed, 11 Jan 2006 02:04:47 +0000
> Received: from delivery2.pens.microsoft.com ([207.46.248.41])
> 	by mx13.global.net.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.42)
> 	id 1EwVLy-00031k-Je
> 	for bob.henson@galenx.org.uk; Wed, 11 Jan 2006 02:04:47 +0000
> Received: from TK2MSFTDDSQ07 ([10.40.5.15]) by delivery2.pens.microsoft.com
> with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.211);
> 	 Tue, 10 Jan 2006 18:04:45 -0800
> Thread-Topic: Microsoft Security Newsletter: Outfitting a new computer for
> the Internet
> thread-index: AcYWU2SXVUxyd1zNS0Gpy7ey5GaJ+A==
> Reply-To: "Microsoft"
> <10_27610_FqgV0Fi6zp+96VAQEVtVNA@newsletters.microsoft.com>
> From: "Microsoft" <10_27610_FqgV0Fi6zp+96VAQEVtVNA@newsletters.microsoft.com>
> 
> Quote off...............
> 
> The last line is the correct From: line - so what gives with line 1? Every
> E-mail I get is the same, so I wondered if it was just me. It isn't new to v
> 1.5, it's been the same for ages.
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Bob
> 
> 
The correct source is 207.46.248.41, which is the 2nd from line above.
That 1st From line (local host) ? /I beleive/  is added by the DNS
server - are you on a VPN or using Win RAS?
0
jg
1/11/2006 8:41:19 PM
Bob Henson wrote:
> Why, when I examine e-mail headers with CTRL-U is the first header
> "From" (as distinct from the "From:" header further down) and the date?
> Sam Spade says it doesn't recognise the header - which seems reasonable
> to me!

It's not actually a header, it's the mbox separator line -- when all the 
message are stored in one file, programs using mbox-format look for a 
line that begins with "From " (including the space).  If you were 
looking at the source of a message on an IMAP server, it wouldn't have 
that From line.

-- 
Michael Cowperthwaite

To send mail, remove 'Z's from the poster's email address.
0
M
1/11/2006 8:43:40 PM
On 01/11/06 15:43, M Cowperthwaite wrote:
> Bob Henson wrote:
>> Why, when I examine e-mail headers with CTRL-U is the first header
>> "From" (as distinct from the "From:" header further down) and the date?
>> Sam Spade says it doesn't recognise the header - which seems reasonable
>> to me!
> 
> It's not actually a header, it's the mbox separator line -- when all the 
> message are stored in one file, programs using mbox-format look for a 
> line that begins with "From " (including the space).  If you were 
> looking at the source of a message on an IMAP server, it wouldn't have 
> that From line.

Maybe it shouldn't be displayed, then, since it's not really part of the 
message?
-- 
Yay!
0
Matt
1/11/2006 9:16:09 PM
On 2006-01-11 21:41, jg wrote:
> On 1/11/2006 11:51 AM Bob Henson scribbled:
> 
>> Terry wrote
>>
>>
>>>> Why, when I examine e-mail headers with CTRL-U is the first header
>>>> "From" (as distinct from the "From:" header further down) and the date?
>>>> Sam Spade says it doesn't recognise the header - which seems reasonable
>>>> to me!
>>
>>> Can you clarify a bit? This is what I see in your header (1st 4 lines):
>>> Path: local01.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.mozilla.org!news.mozilla.org.POSTED!not-for-mail
>>
>>> No other From is listed.
>>
>> It only applies to e-mail, not news. Here's the first bit of one from
>> Microsoft this morning.
>>
>> Quote on ......
>>
>> From - Wed Jan 11 02:08:21 2006
>> X-Account-Key: account2
>> X-UIDL: 47bef90f3b433d04ff22b64da10e7b0e
>> X-Mozilla-Status: 0001
>> X-Mozilla-Status2: 00000000
>> Envelope-to: bob.henson@galenx.org.uk
>> Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1])
>> 	by mx13.global.net.uk with smtp (Exim 4.42)
>> 	id 1EwVLz-00032T-9c
>> 	for bob.henson@galenx.org.uk; Wed, 11 Jan 2006 02:04:47 +0000
>> Received: from delivery2.pens.microsoft.com ([207.46.248.41])
>> 	by mx13.global.net.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.42)
>> 	id 1EwVLy-00031k-Je
>> 	for bob.henson@galenx.org.uk; Wed, 11 Jan 2006 02:04:47 +0000
>> Received: from TK2MSFTDDSQ07 ([10.40.5.15]) by delivery2.pens.microsoft.com
>> with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.211);
>> 	 Tue, 10 Jan 2006 18:04:45 -0800
>> Thread-Topic: Microsoft Security Newsletter: Outfitting a new computer for
>> the Internet
>> thread-index: AcYWU2SXVUxyd1zNS0Gpy7ey5GaJ+A==
>> Reply-To: "Microsoft"
>> <10_27610_FqgV0Fi6zp+96VAQEVtVNA@newsletters.microsoft.com>
>> From: "Microsoft" <10_27610_FqgV0Fi6zp+96VAQEVtVNA@newsletters.microsoft.com>
>>
>> Quote off...............
>>
>> The last line is the correct From: line - so what gives with line 1? Every
>> E-mail I get is the same, so I wondered if it was just me. It isn't new to v
>> 1.5, it's been the same for ages.
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Bob
>>
>>
> The correct source is 207.46.248.41, which is the 2nd from line above.
> That 1st From line (local host) ? /I beleive/  is added by the DNS
> server - are you on a VPN or using Win RAS?

Bob's not talking about 'Received:' headers. He's talking about 'From:'
(according to RFC) and 'From -' (according to the mbox storage format
Mozilla products are using, even the predecessor Netscape did; it
delineates messages). The 'X-<xxx>' before the 'Envelope-to:' are all
Mozilla meta data, all described somewhere on the Mozilla pages (I don't
remember the link just now).

-- 
Kjell
0
Kjell
1/12/2006 6:42:59 AM
M Cowperthwaite wrote:

> Bob Henson wrote:
>> Why, when I examine e-mail headers with CTRL-U is the first header
>> "From" (as distinct from the "From:" header further down) and the date?
>> Sam Spade says it doesn't recognise the header - which seems reasonable
>> to me!
> 
> It's not actually a header, it's the mbox separator line -- when all the 
> message are stored in one file, programs using mbox-format look for a 
> line that begins with "From " (including the space).  If you were 
> looking at the source of a message on an IMAP server, it wouldn't have 
> that From line.

Cool.  I had noticed that too and wondered about it.  That might explain why 
things sometimes went all pear-shaped when I tried to add my kmail mail files 
to my netscape mail files.

Is your name REALLY Cowperthwaite?

-- 
Cheers,
Bev
______________________________________________________
"Parasites plus suckers do not add up to a community."
                                     -- Thomas Sowell
0
The
1/12/2006 6:51:49 AM
The Real Bev wrote:

> M Cowperthwaite wrote:
> 
> 
>>Bob Henson wrote:
>>
>>>Why, when I examine e-mail headers with CTRL-U is the first header
>>>"From" (as distinct from the "From:" header further down) and the date?
>>>Sam Spade says it doesn't recognise the header - which seems reasonable
>>>to me!
>>
>>It's not actually a header, it's the mbox separator line -- when all the 
>>message are stored in one file, programs using mbox-format look for a 
>>line that begins with "From " (including the space).  If you were 
>>looking at the source of a message on an IMAP server, it wouldn't have 
>>that From line.
> 
> 
> Cool.  I had noticed that too and wondered about it.  That might explain why 
> things sometimes went all pear-shaped when I tried to add my kmail mail files 
> to my netscape mail files.
> 
> Is your name REALLY Cowperthwaite?
> 
In TB, click on Help, About, and Credits.  Part way down under Quality 
Assurance.  Does that answer your question?
0
gwtc
1/12/2006 7:45:47 AM
Kjell B. wrote:
> On 2006-01-11 21:41, jg wrote:
> 
>>On 1/11/2006 11:51 AM Bob Henson scribbled:
>>
>>
>>>Terry wrote
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>>Why, when I examine e-mail headers with CTRL-U is the first header
>>>>>"From" (as distinct from the "From:" header further down) and the date?
>>>>>Sam Spade says it doesn't recognise the header - which seems reasonable
>>>>>to me!
>>>
>>>>Can you clarify a bit? This is what I see in your header (1st 4 lines):
>>>>Path: local01.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.mozilla.org!news.mozilla.org.POSTED!not-for-mail
>>>
>>>>No other From is listed.
>>>
>>>It only applies to e-mail, not news. Here's the first bit of one from
>>>Microsoft this morning.
>>>
>>>Quote on ......
>>>
>>>From - Wed Jan 11 02:08:21 2006
>>>X-Account-Key: account2
>>>X-UIDL: 47bef90f3b433d04ff22b64da10e7b0e
>>>X-Mozilla-Status: 0001
>>>X-Mozilla-Status2: 00000000
>>>Envelope-to: bob.henson@galenx.org.uk
>>>Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1])
>>>	by mx13.global.net.uk with smtp (Exim 4.42)
>>>	id 1EwVLz-00032T-9c
>>>	for bob.henson@galenx.org.uk; Wed, 11 Jan 2006 02:04:47 +0000
>>>Received: from delivery2.pens.microsoft.com ([207.46.248.41])
>>>	by mx13.global.net.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.42)
>>>	id 1EwVLy-00031k-Je
>>>	for bob.henson@galenx.org.uk; Wed, 11 Jan 2006 02:04:47 +0000
>>>Received: from TK2MSFTDDSQ07 ([10.40.5.15]) by delivery2.pens.microsoft.com
>>>with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.211);
>>>	 Tue, 10 Jan 2006 18:04:45 -0800
>>>Thread-Topic: Microsoft Security Newsletter: Outfitting a new computer for
>>>the Internet
>>>thread-index: AcYWU2SXVUxyd1zNS0Gpy7ey5GaJ+A==
>>>Reply-To: "Microsoft"
>>><10_27610_FqgV0Fi6zp+96VAQEVtVNA@newsletters.microsoft.com>
>>>From: "Microsoft" <10_27610_FqgV0Fi6zp+96VAQEVtVNA@newsletters.microsoft.com>
>>>
>>>Quote off...............
>>>
>>>The last line is the correct From: line - so what gives with line 1? Every
>>>E-mail I get is the same, so I wondered if it was just me. It isn't new to v
>>>1.5, it's been the same for ages.
>>>
>>>Regards,
>>>
>>>Bob
>>>
>>>
>>
>>The correct source is 207.46.248.41, which is the 2nd from line above.
>>That 1st From line (local host) ? /I beleive/  is added by the DNS
>>server - are you on a VPN or using Win RAS?
> 
> 
> Bob's not talking about 'Received:' headers. He's talking about 'From:'
> (according to RFC) and 'From -' (according to the mbox storage format
> Mozilla products are using, even the predecessor Netscape did; it
> delineates messages). The 'X-<xxx>' before the 'Envelope-to:' are all
> Mozilla meta data, all described somewhere on the Mozilla pages (I don't
> remember the link just now).
> 

The topmost header is from the last server that handled the email.
Your mail server is adding that first 'From' itself
0
Moz
1/12/2006 11:02:32 AM
Moz Champion (Dan) wrote

> Kjell B. wrote:
>> On 2006-01-11 21:41, jg wrote:
>> 
>>>On 1/11/2006 11:51 AM Bob Henson scribbled:
>>>
>>>
>>>>Terry wrote
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>Why, when I examine e-mail headers with CTRL-U is the first header
>>>>>>"From" (as distinct from the "From:" header further down) and the date?
>>>>>>Sam Spade says it doesn't recognise the header - which seems reasonable
>>>>>>to me!
>>>>
>>>>>Can you clarify a bit? This is what I see in your header (1st 4 lines):
>>>>>Path: local01.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.mozilla.org!news.mozilla.org.POSTED!not-for-mail
>>>>
>>>>>No other From is listed.
>>>>
>>>>It only applies to e-mail, not news. Here's the first bit of one from
>>>>Microsoft this morning.
>>>>
>>>>Quote on ......
>>>>
>>>>From - Wed Jan 11 02:08:21 2006
>>>>X-Account-Key: account2
>>>>X-UIDL: 47bef90f3b433d04ff22b64da10e7b0e
>>>>X-Mozilla-Status: 0001
>>>>X-Mozilla-Status2: 00000000
>>>>Envelope-to: bob.henson@galenx.org.uk
>>>>Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1])
>>>>	by mx13.global.net.uk with smtp (Exim 4.42)
>>>>	id 1EwVLz-00032T-9c
>>>>	for bob.henson@galenx.org.uk; Wed, 11 Jan 2006 02:04:47 +0000
>>>>Received: from delivery2.pens.microsoft.com ([207.46.248.41])
>>>>	by mx13.global.net.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.42)
>>>>	id 1EwVLy-00031k-Je
>>>>	for bob.henson@galenx.org.uk; Wed, 11 Jan 2006 02:04:47 +0000
>>>>Received: from TK2MSFTDDSQ07 ([10.40.5.15]) by delivery2.pens.microsoft.com
>>>>with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.211);
>>>>	 Tue, 10 Jan 2006 18:04:45 -0800
>>>>Thread-Topic: Microsoft Security Newsletter: Outfitting a new computer for
>>>>the Internet
>>>>thread-index: AcYWU2SXVUxyd1zNS0Gpy7ey5GaJ+A==
>>>>Reply-To: "Microsoft"
>>>><10_27610_FqgV0Fi6zp+96VAQEVtVNA@newsletters.microsoft.com>
>>>>From: "Microsoft" <10_27610_FqgV0Fi6zp+96VAQEVtVNA@newsletters.microsoft.com>
>>>>
>>>>Quote off...............
>>>>
>>>>The last line is the correct From: line - so what gives with line 1? Every
>>>>E-mail I get is the same, so I wondered if it was just me. It isn't new to v
>>>>1.5, it's been the same for ages.
>>>>
>>>>Regards,
>>>>
>>>>Bob
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>The correct source is 207.46.248.41, which is the 2nd from line above.
>>>That 1st From line (local host) ? /I beleive/  is added by the DNS
>>>server - are you on a VPN or using Win RAS?
>> 
>> 
>> Bob's not talking about 'Received:' headers. He's talking about 'From:'
>> (according to RFC) and 'From -' (according to the mbox storage format
>> Mozilla products are using, even the predecessor Netscape did; it
>> delineates messages). The 'X-<xxx>' before the 'Envelope-to:' are all
>> Mozilla meta data, all described somewhere on the Mozilla pages (I don't
>> remember the link just now).
>> 
> 
> The topmost header is from the last server that handled the email.
> Your mail server is adding that first 'From' itself

I get mail from two different servers here and at work, but they both put
the word From and then the date at the top. Is it standard for all mail
servers to do that? It seems very odd to preface a date stamp with the word
"From" - I would have expected "Date:"

Regards,

Bob

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Bob
1/12/2006 5:29:44 PM
M Cowperthwaite wrote

> Bob Henson wrote:
>> Why, when I examine e-mail headers with CTRL-U is the first header
>> "From" (as distinct from the "From:" header further down) and the date?
>> Sam Spade says it doesn't recognise the header - which seems reasonable
>> to me!
> 
> It's not actually a header, it's the mbox separator line -- when all the 
> message are stored in one file, programs using mbox-format look for a 
> line that begins with "From " (including the space).  If you were 
> looking at the source of a message on an IMAP server, it wouldn't have 
> that From line.
> 

OK, that makes more sense. I still think its an odd convention to use though
- using a word that is already used for another header doesn't seem too
smart to me, especially when followed by a date. I always expect programmers
to be logical. Still, thanks very much for the gen, at least I now know why
it's there.

Regards,

Bob

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0
Bob
1/12/2006 5:37:23 PM
On 2006-01-12 18:29, Bob Henson wrote:
> Moz Champion (Dan) wrote
> 
>> Kjell B. wrote:
>>> On 2006-01-11 21:41, jg wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 1/11/2006 11:51 AM Bob Henson scribbled:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Terry wrote
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>> Why, when I examine e-mail headers with CTRL-U is the first header
>>>>>>> "From" (as distinct from the "From:" header further down) and the date?
>>>>>>> Sam Spade says it doesn't recognise the header - which seems reasonable
>>>>>>> to me!
>>>>>> Can you clarify a bit? This is what I see in your header (1st 4 lines):
>>>>>> Path: local01.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.mozilla.org!news.mozilla.org.POSTED!not-for-mail
>>>>>> No other From is listed.
>>>>> It only applies to e-mail, not news. Here's the first bit of one from
>>>>> Microsoft this morning.
>>>>>
>>>>> Quote on ......
>>>>>
>>>> >From - Wed Jan 11 02:08:21 2006
>>>>> X-Account-Key: account2
>>>>> X-UIDL: 47bef90f3b433d04ff22b64da10e7b0e
>>>>> X-Mozilla-Status: 0001
>>>>> X-Mozilla-Status2: 00000000
>>>>> Envelope-to: bob.henson@galenx.org.uk
>>>>> Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1])
>>>>> 	by mx13.global.net.uk with smtp (Exim 4.42)
>>>>> 	id 1EwVLz-00032T-9c
>>>>> 	for bob.henson@galenx.org.uk; Wed, 11 Jan 2006 02:04:47 +0000
>>>>> Received: from delivery2.pens.microsoft.com ([207.46.248.41])
>>>>> 	by mx13.global.net.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.42)
>>>>> 	id 1EwVLy-00031k-Je
>>>>> 	for bob.henson@galenx.org.uk; Wed, 11 Jan 2006 02:04:47 +0000
>>>>> Received: from TK2MSFTDDSQ07 ([10.40.5.15]) by delivery2.pens.microsoft.com
>>>>> with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.211);
>>>>> 	 Tue, 10 Jan 2006 18:04:45 -0800
>>>>> Thread-Topic: Microsoft Security Newsletter: Outfitting a new computer for
>>>>> the Internet
>>>>> thread-index: AcYWU2SXVUxyd1zNS0Gpy7ey5GaJ+A==
>>>>> Reply-To: "Microsoft"
>>>>> <10_27610_FqgV0Fi6zp+96VAQEVtVNA@newsletters.microsoft.com>
>>>>> From: "Microsoft" <10_27610_FqgV0Fi6zp+96VAQEVtVNA@newsletters.microsoft.com>
>>>>>
>>>>> Quote off...............
>>>>>
>>>>> The last line is the correct From: line - so what gives with line 1? Every
>>>>> E-mail I get is the same, so I wondered if it was just me. It isn't new to v
>>>>> 1.5, it's been the same for ages.
>>>>>
>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>
>>>>> Bob
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> The correct source is 207.46.248.41, which is the 2nd from line above.
>>>> That 1st From line (local host) ? /I beleive/  is added by the DNS
>>>> server - are you on a VPN or using Win RAS?
>>>
>>> Bob's not talking about 'Received:' headers. He's talking about 'From:'
>>> (according to RFC) and 'From -' (according to the mbox storage format
>>> Mozilla products are using, even the predecessor Netscape did; it
>>> delineates messages). The 'X-<xxx>' before the 'Envelope-to:' are all
>>> Mozilla meta data, all described somewhere on the Mozilla pages (I don't
>>> remember the link just now).
>>>
>> The topmost header is from the last server that handled the email.
>> Your mail server is adding that first 'From' itself
> 
> I get mail from two different servers here and at work, but they both put
> the word From and then the date at the top. Is it standard for all mail
> servers to do that? It seems very odd to preface a date stamp with the word
> "From" - I would have expected "Date:"
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Bob
> 

It appears Dan missed my point: I didn't talk about 'Received:' headers
at all, nor did Bob.

What you're seeing ('From - ') Bob, just like Mike and myself commented
on earlier, is what TB's modified mbox format (basically from standard
Unix, see http://www.gsp.com/cgi-bin/man.cgi?section=5&topic=mbox
<quote>The mbox format occured in Version 6 AT&T Unix.</quote>, or
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mbox) adds.

-- 
Kjell
0
Kjell
1/12/2006 8:25:49 PM
gwtc wrote:

> The Real Bev wrote:
>> M Cowperthwaite wrote:
>>>Bob Henson wrote:
>>>
>>>>Why, when I examine e-mail headers with CTRL-U is the first header
>>>>"From" (as distinct from the "From:" header further down) and the date?
>>>>Sam Spade says it doesn't recognise the header - which seems reasonable
>>>>to me!
>>>
>>>It's not actually a header, it's the mbox separator line -- when all the 
>>>message are stored in one file, programs using mbox-format look for a 
>>>line that begins with "From " (including the space).  If you were 
>>>looking at the source of a message on an IMAP server, it wouldn't have 
>>>that From line.
>> 
>> Cool.  I had noticed that too and wondered about it.  That might explain why 
>> things sometimes went all pear-shaped when I tried to add my kmail mail files 
>> to my netscape mail files.
>> 
>> Is your name REALLY Cowperthwaite?
>> 
> In TB, click on Help, About, and Credits.  Part way down under Quality 
> Assurance.  Does that answer your question?

Yup.  It's just such a perfect high-class Brit name that I figured it MUST be 
made up!

"Was it a female gorilla?"
"Of course, there's nothing ODD about Cowperthwaite..."

-- 
Cheers,
Bev
[] [] [] [] [] [] [] [] [] [] [] [] [] [] [] [] [] [] [] []
If voting could really change things, it would be illegal.
                    --Revolution Books, New York, New York
0
The
1/12/2006 9:30:53 PM
On 1/12/2006 4:30 PM The Real Bev wrote:
> gwtc wrote:
> 
>> The Real Bev wrote:
>>> Is your name REALLY Cowperthwaite?
>>>
>> In TB, click on Help, About, and Credits.  Part way down under Quality 
>> Assurance.  Does that answer your question?
> 
> Yup.  It's just such a perfect high-class Brit name that I figured it 
> MUST be made up!


Not to mention the fact that "Miles Cowperthwaite" is a fictional 
character from Saturday Night Live.
0
John
1/12/2006 9:42:37 PM
John Swartzentruber wrote:

> On 1/12/2006 4:30 PM The Real Bev wrote:
> 
>>gwtc wrote:
>>
>>
>>>The Real Bev wrote:
>>>
>>>>Is your name REALLY Cowperthwaite?
>>>>
>>>
>>>In TB, click on Help, About, and Credits.  Part way down under Quality 
>>>Assurance.  Does that answer your question?
>>
>>Yup.  It's just such a perfect high-class Brit name that I figured it 
>>MUST be made up!
> 
> 
> 
> Not to mention the fact that "Miles Cowperthwaite" is a fictional 
> character from Saturday Night Live.
Sorry, can't say, cause I only saw the first few years of SNL.  After 
awhile, when all the good players left, and these newer ones came in, 
it lost its fun.  BTW: I have a blender, anyone got some bats?
0
gwtc
1/12/2006 10:18:07 PM
John Swartzentruber wrote:

> On 1/12/2006 4:30 PM The Real Bev wrote:
>> gwtc wrote:
>>> The Real Bev wrote:
>>>> Is your name REALLY Cowperthwaite?
>>>>
>>> In TB, click on Help, About, and Credits.  Part way down under Quality 
>>> Assurance.  Does that answer your question?
>> 
>> Yup.  It's just such a perfect high-class Brit name that I figured it 
>> MUST be made up!
> 
> Not to mention the fact that "Miles Cowperthwaite" is a fictional 
> character from Saturday Night Live.

I haven't watched SNL for perhaps decades.  I think the final episode I saw 
involved Canteen Boy on a camping trip with perverted Scoutmaster Alec 
Baldwin.  Some things are so awful, in addition to being unfunny, that they 
spread crap over everything they're even near, much less touch.  In awfulness, 
Adam Sandler surpassed even himself singing something about his red sweatshirt.

-- 
Cheers, Bev
--------------------------------------------------------------
"Never keep up with the Joneses. Drag them down to your level.
  It's cheaper."                  -- Quentin Crisp 1908 - 1999
0
The
1/13/2006 12:12:35 AM
Kjell B. wrote

> On 2006-01-12 18:29, Bob Henson wrote:
>> Moz Champion (Dan) wrote
>> 
>>> Kjell B. wrote:
>>>> On 2006-01-11 21:41, jg wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 1/11/2006 11:51 AM Bob Henson scribbled:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Terry wrote
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Why, when I examine e-mail headers with CTRL-U is the first header
>>>>>>>> "From" (as distinct from the "From:" header further down) and the date?
>>>>>>>> Sam Spade says it doesn't recognise the header - which seems reasonable
>>>>>>>> to me!
>>>>>>> Can you clarify a bit? This is what I see in your header (1st 4 lines):
>>>>>>> Path: local01.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.mozilla.org!news.mozilla.org.POSTED!not-for-mail
>>>>>>> No other From is listed.
>>>>>> It only applies to e-mail, not news. Here's the first bit of one from
>>>>>> Microsoft this morning.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Quote on ......
>>>>>>
>>>>> >From - Wed Jan 11 02:08:21 2006
>>>>>> X-Account-Key: account2
>>>>>> X-UIDL: 47bef90f3b433d04ff22b64da10e7b0e
>>>>>> X-Mozilla-Status: 0001
>>>>>> X-Mozilla-Status2: 00000000
>>>>>> Envelope-to: bob.henson@galenx.org.uk
>>>>>> Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1])
>>>>>> 	by mx13.global.net.uk with smtp (Exim 4.42)
>>>>>> 	id 1EwVLz-00032T-9c
>>>>>> 	for bob.henson@galenx.org.uk; Wed, 11 Jan 2006 02:04:47 +0000
>>>>>> Received: from delivery2.pens.microsoft.com ([207.46.248.41])
>>>>>> 	by mx13.global.net.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.42)
>>>>>> 	id 1EwVLy-00031k-Je
>>>>>> 	for bob.henson@galenx.org.uk; Wed, 11 Jan 2006 02:04:47 +0000
>>>>>> Received: from TK2MSFTDDSQ07 ([10.40.5.15]) by delivery2.pens.microsoft.com
>>>>>> with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.211);
>>>>>> 	 Tue, 10 Jan 2006 18:04:45 -0800
>>>>>> Thread-Topic: Microsoft Security Newsletter: Outfitting a new computer for
>>>>>> the Internet
>>>>>> thread-index: AcYWU2SXVUxyd1zNS0Gpy7ey5GaJ+A==
>>>>>> Reply-To: "Microsoft"
>>>>>> <10_27610_FqgV0Fi6zp+96VAQEVtVNA@newsletters.microsoft.com>
>>>>>> From: "Microsoft" <10_27610_FqgV0Fi6zp+96VAQEVtVNA@newsletters.microsoft.com>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Quote off...............
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The last line is the correct From: line - so what gives with line 1? Every
>>>>>> E-mail I get is the same, so I wondered if it was just me. It isn't new to v
>>>>>> 1.5, it's been the same for ages.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Bob
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>> The correct source is 207.46.248.41, which is the 2nd from line above.
>>>>> That 1st From line (local host) ? /I beleive/  is added by the DNS
>>>>> server - are you on a VPN or using Win RAS?
>>>>
>>>> Bob's not talking about 'Received:' headers. He's talking about 'From:'
>>>> (according to RFC) and 'From -' (according to the mbox storage format
>>>> Mozilla products are using, even the predecessor Netscape did; it
>>>> delineates messages). The 'X-<xxx>' before the 'Envelope-to:' are all
>>>> Mozilla meta data, all described somewhere on the Mozilla pages (I don't
>>>> remember the link just now).
>>>>
>>> The topmost header is from the last server that handled the email.
>>> Your mail server is adding that first 'From' itself
>> 
>> I get mail from two different servers here and at work, but they both put
>> the word From and then the date at the top. Is it standard for all mail
>> servers to do that? It seems very odd to preface a date stamp with the word
>> "From" - I would have expected "Date:"
>> 
>> Regards,
>> 
>> Bob
>> 
> 
> It appears Dan missed my point: I didn't talk about 'Received:' headers
> at all, nor did Bob.
> 
> What you're seeing ('From - ') Bob, just like Mike and myself commented
> on earlier, is what TB's modified mbox format (basically from standard
> Unix, see http://www.gsp.com/cgi-bin/man.cgi?section=5&topic=mbox
> <quote>The mbox format occured in Version 6 AT&T Unix.</quote>, or
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mbox) adds.
> 

From which it would appear that it was the intention to have the addressee's
name after the "From " in the first line and then the date - that would have
made some sense. Better still to have a marker that did not duplicate
another header. Anyway, I now understand why it is there, however illogical,
so thanks for your help.

Regards,

Bob


-- 
Remove "x" from address to reply by email.
0
Bob
1/13/2006 7:20:23 AM
On 01/11/06 15:43, M Cowperthwaite wrote:
> It's not actually a header, it's the mbox separator line -- when all the 
> message are stored in one file, programs using mbox-format look for a 
> line that begins with "From " (including the space).  If you were 
> looking at the source of a message on an IMAP server, it wouldn't have 
> that From line.

Does that mean if you put "From " at the beginning of a line in a 
message, it could totally mess up the mbox file?
-- 
Yay!
0
Matt
1/17/2006 3:53:55 AM
Matt Nordhoff <mnordhoff@gmail.com> wrote in
<news:nrmdnSR97LH191HenZ2dnUVZ_tGdnZ2d@mozilla.org>:

> On 01/11/06 15:43, M Cowperthwaite wrote:
>> It's not actually a header, it's the mbox separator line -- when
>> all the message are stored in one file, programs using
>> mbox-format look for a line that begins with "From " (including
>> the space).  If you were looking at the source of a message on an
>> IMAP server, it wouldn't have that From line.
>
> Does that mean if you put "From " at the beginning of a line in a
> message, it could totally mess up the mbox file?

No, clients have to escape that in the body before storing it in the
mbox file.  Often it's done by changing it to ">From ", but I don't
know how Mozilla's mboxes handle it.

From blah blah.

Now you can open your mbox in a text editor and see what happened to
the line above.

-- 
�Q�
0
ISO
1/17/2006 5:05:36 AM
On 01/17/06 00:05, »Q« wrote:
> No, clients have to escape that in the body before storing it in the
> mbox file.  Often it's done by changing it to ">From ", but I don't
> know how Mozilla's mboxes handle it.
> 
> From blah blah.
> 
> Now you can open your mbox in a text editor and see what happened to
> the line above.

I didn't see any escaping at all in nano, but everything certainly 
wasn't ruined.
-- 
Yay!
0
Matt
1/17/2006 7:01:24 AM
Matt Nordhoff <mnordhoff@gmail.com> wrote in
<news:1_udnV-HPprEC1HeRVn-pQ@mozilla.org>:

> On 01/17/06 00:05, �Q� wrote:
>> No, clients have to escape that in the body before storing it in
>> the mbox file.  Often it's done by changing it to ">From ", but I
>> don't know how Mozilla's mboxes handle it.
>>
>> From blah blah.
>>
>> Now you can open your mbox in a text editor and see what happened
>> to the line above.
>
> I didn't see any escaping at all in nano, but everything certainly
> wasn't ruined.

I really shouldn't have said "have to escape".  I can't find any
info about exactly what mbox format Mozillan apps use.  The
Wikipedia says, "The Mozilla family of MUAs (Mozilla, Netscape,
Thunderbird, et al.) - use an /mboxrd/ variation with more complex
/From line/ quoting rules".  But the Wikipedia isn't always right.

-- 
�Q�
0
ISO
1/17/2006 7:58:15 AM
On 01/17/06 02:58, »Q« wrote:
> I really shouldn't have said "have to escape".  I can't find any
> info about exactly what mbox format Mozillan apps use.  The
> Wikipedia says, "The Mozilla family of MUAs (Mozilla, Netscape,
> Thunderbird, et al.) - use an /mboxrd/ variation with more complex
> /From line/ quoting rules".  But the Wikipedia isn't always right.

Interesting.

I tested it in mozilla.test (on the off-chance it would do harm, I 
didn't want to mess up an important, busy newsgroup for people), and if 
I put "From - Tue Jan 17 03:10:55 2006" on a line by itself, a space was 
put at the beginning of the line.
-- 
Yay!
0
Matt
1/17/2006 8:47:09 AM
Reply:

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