Gecko 17 as the base for B2G v1

Release drivers for the B2G project recently got together to discuss =
committing to a specific Gecko version for B2G v1**, and we've all =
agreed on Gecko 17 making the most sense from the point of view of =
technical requirements, resourcing, testing, and timelines. Platform =
changes for B2G have been occurring on mozilla-central, and builds of =
B2G will continue to pull in mozilla-central's Gecko until the 8/27 =
merge.

At that time, Gecko 17 will move from mozilla-central to mozilla-aurora. =
Active Gecko platform changes in support of B2G v1 will move to =
mozilla-aurora, with changes of course being merged back to m-c as well. =
Intermediate deliverables would be built using Gecko from =
mozilla-aurora. And contributed "B2G v2" platform work could continue on =
mozilla-central.

On 10/7, we'll similarly move active B2G v1 platform development to =
mozilla-beta, and on 11/19 work will move to the mozilla-esr17 branch. A =
notice referencing this dev.platform post will be sent to the enterprise =
list shortly for comment, as some of the ESR goals in [1] will need to =
change slightly.

We've discussed concerns around actively developing a 1.0 product while =
the underlying version of Gecko moves through the trains (mostly from a =
B2G regressing desktop/mobile/ESR point of view). The large majority of =
cross-platform architectural changes will occur before FF17 comes off of =
m-c, and most of the fixes in support of B2G that happen after that date =
will be B2G-specific. For that reason, we mostly see benefit to the =
cross-pollination of testing that will occur between B2G and other Gecko =
17 supported platforms.

One thing to keep in mind is that B2G is now an equal citizen on =
branches carrying FF17. Except in extreme circumstances, any =
desktop/mobile change that negatively impacts B2G builds in a =
significant way will be backed out (and vice versa).

Please let us know if you have any questions, or if anything could use =
further clarification. Please also see [2] for a similar conversation =
happening around Gaia v1 convergence if interested. Thanks!

-Alex Keybl
Release Manager, Mozilla


** Please note that "B2G v1" just denotes the first version of the B2G =
project available on publicly available hardware
[1] https://wiki.mozilla.org/Enterprise/Firefox/ExtendedSupport:Proposal
[2] =
https://groups.google.com/group/mozilla.dev.gaia/browse_thread/thread/0088=
12000dccb65c#=
0
Alex
8/1/2012 9:47:58 PM
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On 8/1/12 5:47 PM, Alex Keybl wrote:
> any desktop/mobile change that negatively impacts B2G builds in a significant way will be backed out (and vice versa).

Do we have any sort of B2G test coverage?  Ideally on try?

-Boris
0
Boris
8/2/2012 4:30:30 AM
--Apple-Mail=_8EBE207C-44D6-4626-8D8B-838E01F03A7E
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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	charset=us-ascii


We have test coverage using emulators, and actual hardware (panda =
boards) is being set up. Reporting of the results and integration is =
very lacking, and until those pieces fall into place (e.g. try =
integration), the developer experience is going to suck a lot if we =
enforce the rule below (backout). We might want to try a "coordinate" =
instead of the automatic back out approach. If some change breaks B2G, =
we will try to negotiate with the patch author whether we can back it =
out and land it later or back it out and we help fix the B2G regression =
and then re-land etc. If you break B2G, the feedback is not immediate, =
and there is almost no fair and reasonable way for general m-c =
committers to predict and test for B2G regressions (the A team is =
working really hard on fixing this).

Andreas

On Aug 1, 2012, at 9:30 PM, Boris Zbarsky wrote:

> On 8/1/12 5:47 PM, Alex Keybl wrote:
>> any desktop/mobile change that negatively impacts B2G builds in a =
significant way will be backed out (and vice versa).
>=20
> Do we have any sort of B2G test coverage?  Ideally on try?
>=20
> -Boris
> _______________________________________________
> dev-platform mailing list
> dev-platform@lists.mozilla.org
> https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/dev-platform


--Apple-Mail=_8EBE207C-44D6-4626-8D8B-838E01F03A7E--
0
Andreas
8/2/2012 5:44:50 AM
On 01/08/2012 22:47, Alex Keybl wrote:
> On 10/7, we'll similarly move active B2G v1 platform development to
> mozilla-beta, and on 11/19 work will move to the mozilla-esr17 branch. A
> notice referencing this dev.platform post will be sent to the enterprise
> list shortly for comment, as some of the ESR goals in [1] will need to
> change slightly.

Can you elaborate on the goal changes?

The only thing I can see from your enterprise post is the addition of 
the support of B2G off the next ESR branch.

If I'm understanding correctly then there is no intended affect on ESR 
itself?

Thanks
Mark.

> [1] https://wiki.mozilla.org/Enterprise/Firefox/ExtendedSupport:Proposal

0
Mark
8/2/2012 8:33:28 AM
For a discussion of current B2G test automation status and future plans, 
see this blog post:

http://jagriffin.wordpress.com/2012/07/31/mozilla-a-team-b2g-test-automation-update/

Jonathan

On 8/1/2012 9:30 PM, Boris Zbarsky wrote:
> On 8/1/12 5:47 PM, Alex Keybl wrote:
>> any desktop/mobile change that negatively impacts B2G builds in a
>> significant way will be backed out (and vice versa).
>
> Do we have any sort of B2G test coverage? Ideally on try?
>
> -Boris
0
Jonathan
8/2/2012 4:44:18 PM
On 8/1/12 2:47 PM, Alex Keybl wrote:
> ... and on 11/19 work will move to the mozilla-esr17 branch.

I don't really understand this, perhaps I am missing something?

ESR and a v1.0 product seem inherently at odds. EG, I would assume that 
B2G will be making substantial and even high-risk changes right up to 
the day of release (and afterwards, should a 1.1 thing be needed). 
That's obviously different than ESR's primary goal, and even aurora/beta.

I would have guessed B2G would want to create something like a 
"mozilla17-b2g" branch -- a stable (wrt non-B2G changes) Gecko 17 base, 
pulling in changes from aurora-17 / beta-17 as those trains run. But 
also allowing any changes B2G wants without worrying about impact to 
other products.

Justin
0
Justin
8/2/2012 5:37:29 PM
On 8/2/12 1:44 AM, Andreas Gal wrote:
> Reporting of the results and integration is very lacking, and until those pieces fall into place (e.g. try integration), the developer experience is going to suck a lot if we enforce the rule below (backout).

That's the concern, yes.

Basically, if we're going to have the rules proposed at the level of 
testing we have now then the path of least resistance for me is probably 
to land nothing else for the rest of the 17 cycle because it almost 
certainly save me a bunch of time to do things that way...

If we get to a point where we have decent try test coverage, it's a 
different story.

-Boris
0
Boris
8/2/2012 6:13:33 PM
The ESR branch's purpose previously was to support enterprise deployments. Now that we are supporting both desktop deployments and B2G v1 on that branch, security/stability changes will not be the only fixes taken. There may be B2G-specific changes and minor cross-platform changes in support of B2G taken on that branch as well.

-AlexMark Banner <mbanner@mozilla.com> wrote:On 01/08/2012 22:47, Alex Keybl wrote:
> On 10/7, we'll similarly move active B2G v1 platform development to
> mozilla-beta, and on 11/19 work will move to the mozilla-esr17 branch. A
> notice referencing this dev.platform post will be sent to the enterprise
> list shortly for comment, as some of the ESR goals in [1] will need to
> change slightly.

Can you elaborate on the goal changes?

The only thing I can see from your enterprise post is the addition of 
the support of B2G off the next ESR branch.

If I'm understanding correctly then there is no intended affect on ESR 
itself?

Thanks
Mark.

> [1] https://wiki.mozilla.org/Enterprise/Firefox/ExtendedSupport:Proposal

_______________________________________________
dev-platform mailing list
dev-platform@lists.mozilla.org
https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/dev-platform
0
akeybl
8/2/2012 6:49:00 PM
Your expectation that we'll still be taking major cross-platform changes to Gecko that late in the 17 cycle does not line up with the planning being done in the B2G dev team. If at any point it becomes clear that we need to pull B2G v1's Gecko off the trains for the sake of other products' qualIty, we'll create a separate branch entirely. We agreed that based upon current planning, it made more sense to be reactive than proactive here.

-Alex

Justin Dolske <dolske@mozilla.com> wrote:On 8/1/12 2:47 PM, Alex Keybl wrote:
> ... and on 11/19 work will move to the mozilla-esr17 branch.

I don't really understand this, perhaps I am missing something?

ESR and a v1.0 product seem inherently at odds. EG, I would assume that 
B2G will be making substantial and even high-risk changes right up to 
the day of release (and afterwards, should a 1.1 thing be needed). 
That's obviously different than ESR's primary goal, and even aurora/beta.

I would have guessed B2G would want to create something like a 
"mozilla17-b2g" branch -- a stable (wrt non-B2G changes) Gecko 17 base, 
pulling in changes from aurora-17 / beta-17 as those trains run. But 
also allowing any changes B2G wants without worrying about impact to 
other products.

Justin
_______________________________________________
dev-platform mailing list
dev-platform@lists.mozilla.org
https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/dev-platform
0
akeybl
8/2/2012 6:53:17 PM
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