Code Bits - Closing.

Some conclusions:

1.- If the key is computer stored/carried/scanned: make it long. Who cares?
2.- If the key is written down, keep it between 10 and 20 chars.
3.- Use lowercase Latin alphabet or Latin numbers.
4.- Present then with an appealing rhythm.

Details:
Storage:       http://www.grc.com/groups/sqrl:5173
Used symbols:  http://www.GRC.com/groups/sqrl:5174
Length         http://www.GRC.com/groups/sqrl:5177
Format/Rhythm  http://www.GRC.com/groups/sqrl:5178

HTH.

-- 
Mark Cross @ 02/14/2014 12:02 a.m.
A good traveler has no fixed plans, and is not intent on arriving. — Lao Tzu

0
Mark
2/14/2014 4:10:06 AM
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On 2014-02-14 04:10:06 +0000, Mark Cross said:

> Some conclusions:
> 
> 3.- Use lowercase Latin alphabet or Latin numbers.
> 

Please, please, please no Latin numbers, they are so very painful. I 
find the Arabic variety so much easier to deal with.

:-)

-jem

0
John
2/14/2014 9:13:34 AM
On 14-02-14 04:13 AM, John Milburn wrote:
> On 2014-02-14 04:10:06 +0000, Mark Cross said:
>
>> Some conclusions:
>>
>> 3.- Use lowercase Latin alphabet or Latin numbers.
>>
>
> Please, please, please no Latin numbers, they are so very painful. I
> find the Arabic variety so much easier to deal with.
>
> :-)
>
> -jem
>

Ho Ho Ho. Although I was pulled up short by a friend when I referred to 
the (0-9) numerals as Arabic and they referred me to what is currently 
in use in Arabic speaking places, which only slightly resembles what you 
are referring to.

All of this choice of character sets though is moot outside of our use 
of the standard English set. Once we start translating the client into 
other languages, other character sets come into play.

So that once we decide on our symbol set size (10, 32, 64 etc) what 
character represents which specific numeric position in the symbol set 
is a choice of the translation set e.g. with just numerals

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Numerical_digit

Manderin (Only the first three numerals can be represented in ascii)
0 => O
1 => -
2 => =


0
ramriot
2/14/2014 4:46:04 PM
ramriot was heard to say :

> On 14-02-14 04:13 AM, John Milburn wrote:
>> On 2014-02-14 04:10:06 +0000, Mark Cross said:
>>
>>> Some conclusions:
>>>
>>> 3.- Use lowercase Latin alphabet or Latin numbers.

>> Please, please, please no Latin numbers, they are so very painful. I
>> find the Arabic variety so much easier to deal with.

> Ho Ho Ho. Although I was pulled up short by a friend when I referred to
> the (0-9) numerals as Arabic and they referred me to what is currently
> in use in Arabic speaking places, which only slightly resembles what you
> are referring to.

The symbols we use everyday (0-9) are called Hindu-Arabic. Because the 
Eastern Arabic world use a somewhat similar but clearly distinct set:
    ٠‎ - ١‎ - ٢‎ - ٣‎ - ٤‎ - ٥‎ - ٦‎ - ٧‎ - ٨‎ - ٩

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arabic_numerals

> All of this choice of character sets though is moot outside of our use
> of the standard English set. Once we start translating the client into
> other languages, other character sets come into play.

I am sure that is not true.

> Manderin (Only the first three numerals can be represented in ascii)
> 0 => O
> 1 => -
> 2 => =

The Wikipedia article should be wrong, then, as it says:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_numerals
    "Most people and institutions in China primarily use the Arabic system
     for convenience, with traditional Chinese numerals used in finance,
     mainly for writing amounts on checks and banknotes and some ceremonial
     occasions."

-- 
Mark Cross @ 02/14/2014 2:44 p.m.
Welcome what you can't avoid.

0
Mark
2/14/2014 6:56:04 PM
John Milburn was heard to say :

> On 2014-02-14 04:10:06 +0000, Mark Cross said:
> 
>> Some conclusions:
>> 
>> 3.- Use lowercase Latin alphabet or Latin numbers.
>> 
> 
> Please, please, please no Latin numbers, they are so very painful. I
> find the Arabic variety so much easier to deal with.

LOL, yes, sorry, I meant to say Hindu-Arabic (0-9). Latin numerals, easily 
interpreted as saying "Roman numerals" are a real pain to use.

Thanks for the correction.

-- 
Mark Cross @ 02/14/2014 2:56 p.m.
To steal ideas from one person is plagiarism; to steal from many is 
research.

0
Mark
2/14/2014 6:58:55 PM
[for the unabridged version, see Mark Cross's post above]

> > All of this choice of character sets though is moot outside
> > of our use of the standard English set. Once we start
> > translating the client into other languages, other character
> > sets come into play.
> 
> I am sure that is not true.

Though obviously not insurmountable, I agree that at least the 
ten decimal digits 0 through 9 will always be available on any 
of SQRL's target platforms. So that's another tick in favor of 
just the ten numeric digits.

-- 
________________________________________________________________
Steve.               Working on moving the SQRL project forward.
0
Steve
2/14/2014 7:04:42 PM
This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156)
--1DsMa0TQqPhbRMXdJnquEe0CriMgdVk1w
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hi,

Am 14.02.2014 20:04, schrieb Steve Gibson:
> Though obviously not insurmountable, I agree that at least the=20
> ten decimal digits 0 through 9 will always be available on any=20
> of SQRL's target platforms. So that's another tick in favor of=20
> just the ten numeric digits.

They are probably available everywhere, but they are not necessarily
easy to enter. Over on Android (with the vanilla AOSP keyboard), you can
either tap quite long on the first row of characters or switch to the
"numerical" mode in order to enter a decimal digits.

It is definitely easier to enter lower case characters - at least with
the English and/or German keyboard layout.

Best regards,
Karol Babioch


--1DsMa0TQqPhbRMXdJnquEe0CriMgdVk1w
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0
Karol
2/14/2014 8:14:04 PM
On 14-02-14 03:14 PM, Karol Babioch wrote:
> Hi,
>
> Am 14.02.2014 20:04, schrieb Steve Gibson:
>> Though obviously not insurmountable, I agree that at least the
>> ten decimal digits 0 through 9 will always be available on any
>> of SQRL's target platforms. So that's another tick in favor of
>> just the ten numeric digits.
>
> They are probably available everywhere, but they are not necessarily
> easy to enter. Over on Android (with the vanilla AOSP keyboard), you can
> either tap quite long on the first row of characters or switch to the
> "numerical" mode in order to enter a decimal digits.
>
> It is definitely easier to enter lower case characters - at least with
> the English and/or German keyboard layout.
>
> Best regards,
> Karol Babioch
>

I think in android and possibly IOS if you define a field as numeric 
only that you can call on the dial keyboard as the default selected for 
that field. That way you will always be presented with a clear 12 key 
keyboard 0-9 # and *.
0
ramriot
2/14/2014 8:36:29 PM
[for the unabridged version, see ramriot's post above]

> I think in android and possibly IOS if you define a field as
> numeric only that you can call on the dial keyboard as the
> default selected for that field. That way you will always be
> presented with a clear 12 key keyboard 0-9 # and *.

Right.

An iOS developer told me that the decimal numerals keyboard can 
be requested at any time.

-- 
________________________________________________________________
Steve.               Working on moving the SQRL project forward.
0
Steve
2/14/2014 8:53:19 PM
This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156)
--PqBRil3180VdRI6QKruek9fF9vbQ8Q39F
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hi,

Am 14.02.2014 21:36, schrieb ramriot:
> I think in android and possibly IOS if you define a field as numeric
> only that you can call on the dial keyboard as the default selected for=

> that field. That way you will always be presented with a clear 12 key
> keyboard 0-9 # and *.

Ah, sure, you are right. I haven't thought about this, because I just
recently had to enter a numerical string into a text field and was
frustrated.

Best regards,
Karol Babioch


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0
Karol
2/14/2014 11:17:41 PM
Reply:

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