WinWhatWhere Backs Off in Breaking Trapware's Snooper Detector Who's Watching Me

On Monday there was an article on MSNBC.com disclosing that the snooper from
WinWhatWhere (Investigator) was breaking the snooper detector of Trapware
(www.trapware.com).  What WinWhatWhere was doing is described in the article
here:

http://www.msnbc.com/news/728256.asp

WinWhatWhere changed their position and yesterday it was reported that they
will no longer break the program.  That article is here:

http://www.msnbc.com/news/730650.asp

A WinWhatWhere executive was quoted as saying: "I got to thinking writing to
their file wasn't a very nice thing to do," Eaton said. "The thought of
writing into another program's files, well, I guess that's not playing fair.
You don't want anyone to think your program is doing something malicious."

-jerrynicean
0
Jerry
3/29/2002 4:30:00 AM
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"Jerry Nicean" <jerrynicean9@myrealbox.com> wrote:

>http://www.msnbc.com/news/730650.asp

>A WinWhatWhere executive was quoted as saying: "I got to thinking writing to
>their file wasn't a very nice thing to do," Eaton said. "The thought of
>writing into another program's files, well, I guess that's not playing fair.
>You don't want anyone to think your program is doing something malicious."

Yeah, that'd be a stretch, huh?  Wouldn't want anyone to get the wrong
idea, nossir.

Sorry, Mr. Eaton, but you've already shown your colors.  If you hadn't
come under fire for this, I'm personally unconvinced you'd have had any
second thoughts.

Until further notice, WinWhatWhere is on my personal blacklist.

pchelp
0
pchelp
3/29/2002 5:37:00 AM
"Jerry Nicean" <jerrynicean9@myrealbox.com> wrote in message
news:a80qe4$g9$1@news.grc.com...
> On Monday there was an article on MSNBC.com disclosing that the snooper
from
> WinWhatWhere (Investigator) was breaking the snooper detector of Trapware
> (www.trapware.com).  What WinWhatWhere was doing is described in the
article
> here:
>
You see, it's getting a habit.
After TDS they keep coming out the woodwork.
And this one will have its "good reasons",
as did TDS.
Remember ?
Ah, but they are honest people, they would never do
anything to hurt their paying customers.
Right ?
Sure, the world is a wonderful place to live
and my eyes are blue.
Honest !

Regards,
L
0
L
3/29/2002 12:00:00 PM
Ah, but TDS didn't 'break' any other program.
 
Also, they (diamondCS) have changed their policy since the
'discussions' <g> here. TDS-3 now reverts to 'trial' mode if it finds
a 'pirate' key.

regards. 

On Fri, 29 Mar 2002 12:00:58 -0000, "L" <halkienhead@dolfijn.nl>
wrote:

>
>"Jerry Nicean" <jerrynicean9@myrealbox.com> wrote in message
>news:a80qe4$g9$1@news.grc.com...
>> On Monday there was an article on MSNBC.com disclosing that the snooper
>from
>> WinWhatWhere (Investigator) was breaking the snooper detector of Trapware
>> (www.trapware.com).  What WinWhatWhere was doing is described in the
>article
>> here:
>>
>You see, it's getting a habit.
>After TDS they keep coming out the woodwork.
>And this one will have its "good reasons",
>as did TDS.
>Remember ?
>Ah, but they are honest people, they would never do
>anything to hurt their paying customers.
>Right ?
>Sure, the world is a wonderful place to live
>and my eyes are blue.
>Honest !
0
graham
3/29/2002 12:15:00 PM
 Yo, guy! What's particularly amusing to me is these birds thought they'd
take out BOClean as part of their amusements. Suddenly it would seem to
have dawned on them that *some* programs are capable of fighting back.  :)

 W3C has been an amusement to us for quite some time now. And covered of
course (as in "whoops! nasty go byebye.") Gotta love those guys. And , oh
yeah, "Netbus is a legitimate administration tool." They sued us also. So
we gave users the option to not detect Netbus if they really wanted to.

 Should be amusing to see how other variations on the theme of the Digital
Millenium Copyright Act take us ... Who'da ever thunk it that malware
authors could go after those who protect and serve ... but I digress. But
bravo! nonetheless ... W3C peddles their wares to divorce attorneys, much
like (ahem) "VMHS" (covered since 1998) and "D.I.R.T" as Codex has become
known as recently. What a wonderfully small world we live in with all
these hosers afoot and yet those of us who treat those who pay our bills
with respect and support have to endure the digital chalatans of these
days of desperation in da software biz. Moo. Heh.

pchelp wrote:
> Yeah, that'd be a stretch, huh?  Wouldn't want anyone to get the wrong
> idea, nossir.
> 
> Sorry, Mr. Eaton, but you've already shown your colors.  If you hadn't
> come under fire for this, I'm personally unconvinced you'd have had any
> second thoughts.
> 
> Until further notice, WinWhatWhere is on my personal blacklist.
> 
> pchelp
-- 
 NSClean Privacy Software division
 Privacy Software Corporation
 http://www.nsclean.com
 kevinmca@nsclean.com
0
Kevin
3/29/2002 12:47:00 PM
Kevin,
I don't care what your reasons are, you are not allowed
to perform such actions.
Which part don't you understand?
Having a hard time understanding people like you.
TDS is a security application, it hunts trojans.
That's it.
Fighting back ?
By hacking peoples computers, that is what you do.
So be honest to your customers: TDS hunts trojans and if I feel
I have a "valid" reason your computer will be hacked by me.

L.



"Kevin McAleavey" <support@nsclean.com> wrote in message
news:3CA46273.F9250A82@nsclean.com...
> Yo, guy! What's particularly amusing to me is these birds thought they'd
> take out BOClean as part of their amusements. Suddenly it would seem to
> have dawned on them that *some* programs are capable of fighting back.  :)
0
L
3/29/2002 1:50:00 PM
Kevin McAleavey <support@nsclean.com> wrote:

> Yo, guy! What's particularly amusing to me is these birds thought they'd
>take out BOClean as part of their amusements. Suddenly it would seem to
>have dawned on them that *some* programs are capable of fighting back.  :)

'Specially when they're doing it with the blessing of the user.  There
lies the power, man, or at least there itmost certainly SHOULD lie.


> W3C has been an amusement to us for quite some time now. And covered of
>course (as in "whoops! nasty go byebye.") Gotta love those guys. And , oh
>yeah, "Netbus is a legitimate administration tool." They sued us also. So
>we gave users the option to not detect Netbus if they really wanted to.

The guy who wrote NetBus, SUING people for tagging his trojan AS a
trojan??  There's an old proverb for that:  "He Whose Victims Want Him
Behind Bars should not cast Summonses."  Or something like that.


> Should be amusing to see how other variations on the theme of the Digital
>Millenium Copyright Act take us ... 

Yes, the DMCA is legal backing for some potentially very nasty stuff
indeed.  Amusing?  Yep.  Scary, even.


>Who'da ever thunk it that malware
>authors could go after those who protect and serve ... but I digress. But
>bravo! nonetheless ... W3C peddles their wares to divorce attorneys, much
>like (ahem) "VMHS" (covered since 1998) and "D.I.R.T" as Codex has become
>known as recently. What a wonderfully small world we live in with all
>these hosers afoot and yet those of us who treat those who pay our bills
>with respect and support have to endure the digital chalatans of these
>days of desperation in da software biz. Moo. Heh.

Yup.  'Tis all topsy-turvy.

pchelp
0
pchelp
3/29/2002 2:28:00 PM
 You might have misunderstood where I'm coming from - BOClean is an
anti-trojan tool also (like TDS) except that it protects you system in
real-time. Honestly, others here can vouch for my integrity. WinWhatWhere
also thought that they could disable BOClean's protection against "W3C"
.... only difference was that W3C was unable to stop BOClean, unlike the
products in the MSNBC story ... BioNet, Mosucker and other nasties have
tried to take out BOClean like they do every major namebrand antivirus,
firewall and yes, even TDS. That was what I meant by "amusing" ... given
that we wear BLUE hats here, last thing we're going to do is condone
vandalism of other people's software. unless you're Microsoft of course. 
:)

L wrote:
> 
> Kevin,
> I don't care what your reasons are, you are not allowed
> to perform such actions.
> Which part don't you understand?
> Having a hard time understanding people like you.
> TDS is a security application, it hunts trojans.
> That's it.
> Fighting back ?
> By hacking peoples computers, that is what you do.
> So be honest to your customers: TDS hunts trojans and if I feel
> I have a "valid" reason your computer will be hacked by me.
> 
> L.
-- 
 NSClean Privacy Software division
 Privacy Software Corporation
 http://www.nsclean.com
 kevinmca@nsclean.com
0
Kevin
3/29/2002 3:09:00 PM
pchelp wrote:
> 
> 'Specially when they're doing it with the blessing of the user.  There
> lies the power, man, or at least there itmost certainly SHOULD lie.

 We have always had that simple philosophy over here - if someone gives us
money, the LEAST we can do is EARN it.  :)
 
> The guy who wrote NetBus, SUING people for tagging his trojan AS a
> trojan??  There's an old proverb for that:  "He Whose Victims Want Him
> Behind Bars should not cast Summonses."  Or something like that.

 Is that stones or what? Ayup, those clowns down in Florida tried to sue
us for blocking Netbus ... and much like your own situation, when the
chips were down, we were there by our lonesome. That's why we settled -
"OK, we'll put a "do NOT detect Netbus" in our configuration menu (with
default as "DETECT and Kill the sumbitch") and that settled it ... but
man, there's something REALLY REALLY WRONG when the authors of nasties can
sue those of us who stop them and actually geta judge to SIDE with the
bastards ... but we managed to prevail and remain despite not selling out
like McAfee and Norton did ... they DO NOT detect it ... and it's wildfire
nastyville undetected as it is by most antiviruses.
 
> Yes, the DMCA is legal backing for some potentially very nasty stuff
> indeed.  Amusing?  Yep.  Scary, even.

 We got our dose of it here.  :)
 
> Yup.  'Tis all topsy-turvy.
> pchelp

 22 caliber minds in a 357 Magnum world. Heh.

-- 
 NSClean Privacy Software division
 Privacy Software Corporation
 http://www.nsclean.com
 kevinmca@nsclean.com
0
Kevin
3/29/2002 3:14:00 PM
Could this have been kept in one thread?

On Fri, 29 Mar 2002 10:14:57 -0500, Kevin McAleavey
<support@nsclean.com> wrote:

[snip]
0
graham
3/29/2002 3:16:00 PM
You know, 'L', there's absolutely no parallel to be drawn from the two
separate issues to start with. (If you weren't an idiot with your own agenda
here, you'd admit that). But specifically for your little pea-brain, I'll
spell it out: TDS was merely attempting to protect their copy-writed
software from low-life, petty thieves. What measures they took to do so
never in any way impacted ANY other program on a users' computer besides TDS
itself. WWW, on the other hand, ACTIVELY, MALICIOUSLY WOULD !!!!HACK!!!!
five other programs designed to DETECT WWW! So, what exactly don't you
understand about the difference here? And why don't you have the balls to
post under a verifible name, for Gods' sake? It couldn't be because you're a
little whiny bitch that doesn't want to pay for programs, right? Or perhaps
an employee of WWW? Pete
"L" <halkienhead@dolfijn.nl> wrote in message
news:a81l5o$prb$1@news.grc.com...
>
> You see, it's getting a habit.
> After TDS they keep coming out the woodwork.
> And this one will have its "good reasons",
> as did TDS.
> Remember ?
> Ah, but they are honest people, they would never do
> anything to hurt their paying customers.
> Right ?
> Sure, the world is a wonderful place to live
> and my eyes are blue.
> Honest !
>
> Regards,
> L
>
>


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.343 / Virus Database: 190 - Release Date: 3/22/2002
0
spy1
3/29/2002 4:51:00 PM
On Thu, 28 Mar 2002 21:30:52 -0700, "Jerry Nicean"
<jerrynicean9@myrealbox.com> wrote:

>You don't want anyone to think your program is doing something malicious."

Especially not when it is. :/


--
Catherine Hampton             <ariel@tempest.boxmail.com>
Home Page          *            <http://www.devsite.org/>
The SpamBouncer    *        <http://www.spambouncer.org/>

(Please use this address for replies -- the address in my header is a
spam trap.)
0
Catherine
3/29/2002 8:10:00 PM
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